Promotiions in the US Navy

[Bill Shatzer]

My father was the copilot on a Navy patrol bomber which went missing on
a bombing mission over Paramushiro in the Japanese occupied Kuriles. In
researching this incident, I've ascertained the the pilot was one
Lt.(jg) Alpehus Wheat.

What I find interesting is Wheat is listed as having recieved his
pilot's rating in January of 1938 and had accummulated over 2,500 flight
hours at the time the aircraft was lost - which would indicate that
Wheat had at least six years in flight status with the Navy.

Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)? What might have
accounted for that? The number of flight hours would seem to preclude
any extended periods of sickness or injury.

[Michael Emrys]

Post by Bill Shatzer
Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)? What might
have accounted for that? The number of flight hours would seem to
preclude any extended periods of sickness or injury.

This is pure speculation on my part, but there were a fair number of
pilots in those days who were perhaps great in the air but not
necessarily what one would describe as "responsible adults". If some of
his superiors had ever had cause, or felt that they had cause to give
him bad marks in his fitness reports, that could had held back his
promotion.

Michael

[Roman W]

Post by Michael Emrys
This is pure speculation on my part, but there were a fair number of
pilots in those days who were perhaps great in the air but not
necessarily what one would describe as "responsible adults". If some of

In any profession one encounters people who are technically very
competent but otherwise require supervision and cannot be tasked with
too mucb responsibility.

RW

[Bill Shatzer]

Post by Roman W

Post by Michael Emrys
This is pure speculation on my part, but there were a fair number

of

Post by Michael Emrys
pilots in those days who were perhaps great in the air but not
necessarily what one would describe as "responsible adults". If

In any profession one encounters people who are technically very
competent but otherwise require supervision and cannot be tasked with
too mucb responsibility.

It's rather difficult to imagine a position which affords less
opportunity for supervision and requires more responsibility than the
left hand seat on a patrol bomber on a combat mission.

Had Wheat been technically competent but otherwise sub-optimal, he would
have been assigned as a flight instructor someplace. or perhaps a ferry
pilot, but not a PIC in a combat aircraft.

[John Szalay]

Post by Bill Shatzer
My father was the copilot on a Navy patrol bomber which went missing on
a bombing mission over Paramushiro in the Japanese occupied Kuriles. In
researching this incident, I've ascertained the the pilot was one
Lt.(jg) Alpehus Wheat.
What I find interesting is Wheat is listed as having recieved his
pilot's rating in January of 1938 and had accummulated over 2,500 flight
hours at the time the aircraft was lost - which would indicate that
Wheat had at least six years in flight status with the Navy.
Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)? What might have
accounted for that? The number of flight hours would seem to preclude
any extended periods of sickness or injury.

Opinion:
during the years between the wars, advancement in rank was extremely slow
commands were few , and only went to those in the "old boy" network

[Rich Rostrom]

Post by John Szalay

Post by Bill Shatzer
Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)?

during the years between the wars, advancement in rank was extremely slow
commands were few , and only went to those in the "old boy" network

Yabbut the pilot was lost in about 1944. (The OP
didn't say, but the man had six years flight
status and got wings in 1938.)

By 1944 the Navy had grown to several times its
prewar size. Nearly all pre-war officers had
been promoted, I'd guess.

[Merlin Dorfman]

On Fri, 04 Apr 2014 13:50:39 -0400, Rich Rostrom wrote:

.. had six years flight status and got wings in 1938.)

By 1944 the Navy had grown to several times its prewar size. Nearly all
pre-war officers had been promoted, I'd guess.

With some notable exceptions, e.g, Ellis Zacharias, a four-striper
(Captain) in command of CA-25 USS Salt Lake City in 1940 and still a four-
striper on VJ Day. He retired as a Rear Admiral in 1946 (graveyard
promotion, i.e., never served on active duty as a flag officer).
I've always wondered why he was not promoted during the war. He had
somewhat of a reputation as a maverick (spoke his mind, regardless of who
was listening) and that may have had something to do with it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellis_M._Zacharias
http://ussslcca25.com/zach04.htm

[GFH]

Post by Merlin Dorfman
.. had six years flight status and got wings in 1938.)

By 1944 the Navy had grown to several times its prewar size. Nearly all
pre-war officers had been promoted, I'd guess.

With some notable exceptions, e.g, Ellis Zacharias, a four-striper
(Captain) in command of CA-25 USS Salt Lake City in 1940 and still a four-
striper on VJ Day. He retired as a Rear Admiral in 1946 (graveyard
promotion, i.e., never served on active duty as a flag officer).

There are two different types of "Tombstone Admirals".
One is a captain whose rank is increased by one rank on
retirement because of combat citations. In WWII, the
minimum citation to achieve that level was Legion of
Merit (V). (Remember the recent issue about the V (valor)
difference.) This 'rank' has been called commodore
and rear admiral at various times. Commodore applies
to most retired WWII officers.

The other is a captain who has been promoted to
Rear Admiral and served in that position but
whose promotion was not confirmed by the Senate
prior to retirement. In a sense the promotion is
'confirmed' by retirement. This 'rank' is higher
than commodore.

Yes, the Navy keeps a list and 'higher' has meaning
regarding one's place on the list.

My father was the second type of tombstone admiral.
I know from my father's experience that the Navy was
very aware of the reality of retirement before
congressional promotion. He served as a rear admiral
on one occasion -- a base closing ceremony, a couple
of months prior to retirement (from the USNR). BTW,
my father also met the citation test. He thought,
probably correctly, that the Navy promoted him to
rear admiral so he would retire as the higher type
of tombstone admiral.

GFH

[WJHopwood]

Post by Bill Shatzer
My father was the copilot on a Navy patrol bomber which went missing on
a bombing mission over Paramushiro in the Japanese occupied Kuriles. In
researching this incident, I've ascertained the the pilot was one
Lt.(jg) Alpehus Wheat.
What I find interesting is Wheat is listed as having recieved his
pilot's rating in January of 1938 and had accummulated over 2,500 flight
hours at the time the aircraft was lost - which would indicate that
Wheat had at least six years in flight status with the Navy.
Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)? What might have
accounted for that? The number of flight hours would seem to preclude
any extended periods of sickness or injury.

I believe your question can be answered rather easily. The
information you have about Wheat does not jibe with the
information I have about him.
I show that Wheat received his Naval aviator wings as an
enlisted Chief Radio Electrician on 21 March 1942, not 1938
as you show. He became a commissioned officer after that
probably as an Ensign.
The source of my info is a book I have titled "United
States Navy Wings of Gold-From 1917 to the Present" which
contains a list of all Naval Aviators from the earliest days until
the year of the book's publication in 1995.
Next to each name is shown the year in which that person
earned his wings, his Naval officer rank or enlisted rating at that
time, and a number representing the order in which he became
a Naval aviator.
For example the famous explorer, Admiral Richard E. Byrd,
is listed as being Naval Aviator #608 (meaning 607 others were
ahead of him), the date he earned his wings was 17 April 1918,
and his rank at that time was Lt(jg).
Alpheus Wheat, is listed as having been a Chief Radio
Electrician on 21 March 1942 when he earned his wings, and he
then became Naval Aviator #13613. As was often the case,
enlisted personnel who earned their wings were given officer
rank then or shortly thereafter. However, the rank given was
usually at or near the lowest such Warrant Officer, Chief Warrant
Officer, Ensign, etc. It appears that Wheat was no exception, and
that, together with the relatively short time since he had become
a Naval aviator and when your father knew him, probably explains
why he was only a Lt(jg) at the time.

WJH

[Bill Shatzer]

Post by WJHopwood

Post by Bill Shatzer
My father was the copilot on a Navy patrol bomber which went missing on
a bombing mission over Paramushiro in the Japanese occupied Kuriles. In
researching this incident, I've ascertained the the pilot was one
Lt.(jg) Alpehus Wheat.
What I find interesting is Wheat is listed as having recieved his
pilot's rating in January of 1938 and had accummulated over 2,500 flight
hours at the time the aircraft was lost - which would indicate that
Wheat had at least six years in flight status with the Navy.
Isn't that a rather long time to remain a lowly Lt.(jg)? What might have
accounted for that? The number of flight hours would seem to preclude
any extended periods of sickness or injury.

I believe your question can be answered rather easily. The
information you have about Wheat does not jibe with the
information I have about him.
I show that Wheat received his Naval aviator wings as an
enlisted Chief Radio Electrician on 21 March 1942, not 1938
as you show. He became a commissioned officer after that
probably as an Ensign.
The source of my info is a book I have titled "United
States Navy Wings of Gold-From 1917 to the Present" which
contains a list of all Naval Aviators from the earliest days until
the year of the book's publication in 1995.
Next to each name is shown the year in which that person
earned his wings, his Naval officer rank or enlisted rating at that
time, and a number representing the order in which he became
a Naval aviator.
For example the famous explorer, Admiral Richard E. Byrd,
is listed as being Naval Aviator #608 (meaning 607 others were
ahead of him), the date he earned his wings was 17 April 1918,
and his rank at that time was Lt(jg).
Alpheus Wheat, is listed as having been a Chief Radio
Electrician on 21 March 1942 when he earned his wings, and he
then became Naval Aviator #13613. As was often the case,
enlisted personnel who earned their wings were given officer
rank then or shortly thereafter. However, the rank given was
usually at or near the lowest such Warrant Officer, Chief Warrant
Officer, Ensign, etc. It appears that Wheat was no exception, and
that, together with the relatively short time since he had become
a Naval aviator and when your father knew him, probably explains
why he was only a Lt(jg) at the time.

My information on Wheat comes from a copy of the Navy incident/accident
report documenting the loss of the aircraft.

Your explanation makes some sense - although if Wheat was realy didn't
receive his pilot's rating until March, 1942, that doesn't leave a lot
of time for him to have accumulated 2,542 flight hours. I suppose that
had he been an enlisted crew member (radio electrician?), he might have
accumulated a substantial number of those hours in the radio compartment
rather than in the cockpit. Did those sorts of flight hours count insuch
such things as accident/incident reports? It would seem the Navy would
be more concerned with the piloting experience of the pilot and not much
concerned with the hours he might have spent as more or less a passenger.

Incidently, does your book note my father - whose name the Navy insisted
on spelling "Schatzer" rather than the correct "Shatzer"?

[WJHopwood]

Post by Bill Shatzer
My information on Wheat comes from a copy of the Navy incident/accident
report documenting the loss of the aircraft....if Wheat was realy didn't
receive his pilot's rating until March, 1942, that doesn't leave a lot of time
for him to have accumulated 2,542 flight hours. I suppose...he might have
accumulated a substantial number of those hours in the radio compartment
rather than in the cockpit. Did those sorts of flight hours count insuch
such things as accident/incident reports?
From the record I have it appears to me that as a Chief Radioman who later

became a Naval aviator that prior to earning his wings Wheat may have
been assigned to flight operations as an enlisted man. Quite likely he was
a flight radio operator and may have had many flight hours in that capacity.
That would have certainly been on his record and picked up in any reports
of incidents which involved him which occurred both before and after he
became a commissioned officer and Naval Aviator.

Post by Bill Shatzer
It would seem the Navy would be more concerned with the piloting
experience of the pilot and not much concerned with the hours he might
have spent as more or less a passenger.

The Navy would have been equally concerned with both. He was hardly
just a "passenger." Long experience as a flight radioman. as well as his
prior leadership experience as a Chief Petty Officer would have equipped
Wheat with a wealth of knowledge and experience which most of the
other pilots did not have. That could have resulted in Wheat's selection
for certain missions for which he may have been particularly suited above
the others.

Post by Bill Shatzer
Incidently, does your book note my father - whose name the Navy insisted
on spelling "Schatzer" rather than the correct "Shatzer"?

I looked it up under both spellings but it isn't in my book. However there
are two missing lists- the names of the limited number of Naval aviators
who graduated from Advance Flight Schools, one at Pensacola, the other
at Corpus Christie. For some reason the book's author was not able to obtain
those names and your father's may have been one of them.

WJH

[R Leonard]

On Wednesday, April 2, 2014 8:03:50 PM UTC-4, Bill
Incidently, does your book note my father - whose name
the Navy insisted
on spelling "Schatzer" rather than the correct "Shatzer"?

"Shatzer" does not appear in the 31 July 1944 "Register of
Commissioned and Warrant Officers of the U S Naval
Reserve." On the other hand, on page 1137 appears two
gents named "Schatzer". As only one is an a naval
aviator, I suspect the one you're looking for is Schatzer,
William N., ENS AVN with a date of rank of 15 Jun 1943.
The entry notes an "09" for the heavier-than-air naval
aviator designation and a "15" for completing a specific
course on air navigation (this being beyond the subject
matter taught in flight training) This is the only
reference I can find.

Our friend, LTJG Alpheus Achilles Wheat, Jr., first
appears as a naval aviator in the 1 July 1942 "Register of
Commissioned and Warrant Officers of the U S Navy and
Marine Corps" on page 484, line 13727, where he appears
with the warrant grade of Chief Radio Electrician (this a
temporary wartime promotion) with a date of rank of 21 Mar
1942. His previous status is noted as "Enlisted."
I would suspect that he was previously a rated RM2c or
even an RM1c. He shows up in the 1 Jul 1943 edition on
page 160, line 8953, as a LTJG with a date of rank of 1
May 1943. He shows up in the 1 Jul 1944 edition on page
186, line 11727 with no change to the information and
likewise he's in the 1 Jul 1945 edition on page 151, line
13490; though I would suspect, from what you've written,
by that time he being carried in an MIA status . . . a
hard look at the registers can find folks who went missing
in even the first six months of the war being carried at
their rank at the time they went missing.

I'd also point out here that it was not at all unusual
during this period Wheat was commissioned for a warrant
officer to be commissioned and skip being an ENS . . . I
can think of one or two who even skipped ENS and LTJG,
going straight to LT. Early in the war, like in the first
six months or so, there was a tendency to take enlisted
aviators, the NAPs, and promote them to a Warrant grade,
and then subsequently commission them, usually as a LTJG
and sometimes as an LT. When the personnel situation
settled down a bit, most of the remaining NAPs were
directly commissioned, usually as LTJGs. This process
went on through the war, one can find brand new LTJGs in
the 1945 USN Register with a previous status noted as
"Enlisted". There were a very few, an extremely small
number, of NAPs who held out, declining the commission,
and an equally small number who, usually because they were
no longer qualified for flight duty, and that usually
because of age who were never offered a commission.

Rich

[David Wilma]

Promotion in the U.S. Military in World War II was as much a matter of
chance as any sort of plan. My father left the Air Corps as a First Lieutenant
after almost three years as a multi-engine and instrument rated
instructor pilot and a tour over The Hump. He accumulated something
like 1500 hours of flight time (Hump tour was 600 hours) with hundreds
of landings.

His brother was in the Navy and flew flying boats on patrol. He logged
almost twice the flying time in four years with less than a third
or half the landings. He left the service as a Lieutenant Commander.

[WJHopwood]

Post by David Wilma
Promotion in the U.S. Military in World War II was as much a matter of
chance as...plan. My father left the Air Corps as a First Lieutenant
after almost three years He accumulated something like 1500 hours of
flight time...with hundreds of landings....His brother was in the Navy and
.....logged almost twice the flying time....with less than a third or half the
landings. He left the service as a Lieutenant Commander.

I can't vouch for promotions in the Army or Army Air Corps but from
memory I believe I can for the Navy. Naval officer upgrades, with the
exception of individual selection for high command, or in very special
cases (few and far between) involving exceptional performance in the
field, were made to higher rank by group. They were "temporary for the
duration," which meant nothing to Reserve officers but those in the
Regular service might be required to go back to permanent (usually lesser)
rank when the war was over.
Upgrades were not based on individual records of flight time or
sea duty but on date of rank by group, and depended on the operational
needs of the service for officers of a certain higher rank. They applied
to hose holding a specified "on or before" date of current rank and were
disseminated Navy-wide in a plain language message called an ALNAV
to all units and ships at the same time.
The text of the ALNAV read somewhat like this..."To the rank of
Lieutenant Commander--Lieutenants with date of rank (on or before a
specified date). Or, to the rank of Lieutenant-- Lieutenants (junior grade)
with date of rank (on or before)....etc.
Such blanket upgrades usually applied to one rank only but IIRC
there were occasions when more than one rank was upgraded in the same
ALNAV.

WJH